posted by ![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
jwaneeta at 11:17pm on 09/03/2005
jwaneeta at 11:17pm on 09/03/2005http://p096.ezboard.com/fgeniusnewsfrm2.showMessage?topicID=33.topic
which explicates upon women, genius, souls, and why we don't have any of that. God, the hate. Aren't we sufficiently lipposuctioned and subjugated yet?
I wanked thusly:
My response exactly. Then I spent the half the evening remembering the ex-lover -- the liberal/working artist/pro-feminist boyfriend who felt he had to explain the song Empty Chairs At Empty tables to me.
Him: It's about friendship. Women don't have friendships, so you can't really grasp what he's saying about such a loss.
Me: Buh?
Him: Well, I mean women compete for men, so they can't actually be friends with other women.
Me: Are you... what... huh?
Him: Well, women want to connect with a man. That's their focus, what they aim for. They don't have a capacity for friendship. They can't love like men do. Uh, where are you going?
Me: *leaves*
It would be easier to dismiss the offal on that site if I hadn't encountered the same pervasive, subliminal (or not-so-sumbliminal) attitude in so many baseline normal guys. The ex-lover wasn't the only one to explain to me, over the years, that women basically have no souls. I'm not talking about obvious misogynists, I'm talking about seemingly rational dudes.
It seems to be something they soaked up on some basic, unexamined level: "getting" a male is the summit of female beatitude, and any man who fucks a woman is granting her a major boon. Now she has the priviledge of being my sex partner/maid/laundress/cook/therapist/gofer! I have made her complete! Oh, and of course: I have validated her existence by permiting her to service me sexually and domestically. Why isn't that enough for her? How on earth couldher own work anything else still be a consideration, much less a priority? She must be a bad, hatey, emasculating mutation.
Gah, it got to be too much aggravation for me -- I swore off men eight years ago. Ah, sweet liberty. Hail to thee, O peace. I snog thee, financial independence. Celibacy is a small price to pay for such a bullshit-free life.
Hrm. I have seen the wank and it is me. We all have our hot buttons, perhaps. Sticky. I'll be an hour getting it off the ceiling.
*nods off* It's an old tale, isn't it?
which explicates upon women, genius, souls, and why we don't have any of that. God, the hate. Aren't we sufficiently lipposuctioned and subjugated yet?
I wanked thusly:
My response exactly. Then I spent the half the evening remembering the ex-lover -- the liberal/working artist/pro-feminist boyfriend who felt he had to explain the song Empty Chairs At Empty tables to me.
Him: It's about friendship. Women don't have friendships, so you can't really grasp what he's saying about such a loss.
Me: Buh?
Him: Well, I mean women compete for men, so they can't actually be friends with other women.
Me: Are you... what... huh?
Him: Well, women want to connect with a man. That's their focus, what they aim for. They don't have a capacity for friendship. They can't love like men do. Uh, where are you going?
Me: *leaves*
It would be easier to dismiss the offal on that site if I hadn't encountered the same pervasive, subliminal (or not-so-sumbliminal) attitude in so many baseline normal guys. The ex-lover wasn't the only one to explain to me, over the years, that women basically have no souls. I'm not talking about obvious misogynists, I'm talking about seemingly rational dudes.
It seems to be something they soaked up on some basic, unexamined level: "getting" a male is the summit of female beatitude, and any man who fucks a woman is granting her a major boon. Now she has the priviledge of being my sex partner/maid/laundress/cook/therapist/gofer! I have made her complete! Oh, and of course: I have validated her existence by permiting her to service me sexually and domestically. Why isn't that enough for her? How on earth could
Gah, it got to be too much aggravation for me -- I swore off men eight years ago. Ah, sweet liberty. Hail to thee, O peace. I snog thee, financial independence. Celibacy is a small price to pay for such a bullshit-free life.
Hrm. I have seen the wank and it is me. We all have our hot buttons, perhaps. Sticky. I'll be an hour getting it off the ceiling.
*nods off* It's an old tale, isn't it?
(no subject)
If a man ever said that to me, I would disembowel him on the spot. (Because a vague disclaimer is nobody's friend...)
(no subject)
I'm happier.
(no subject)
(no subject)
(no subject)
wow, they sprout like mushrooms, don't they
There are lots of good men out there who do not think this way. But it's because they have managed to rise above their conditioning. It is a misogynistic culture, no question. My experience of New Age spiritually-advanced sensitive types is that they are actually among the worst offenders. (Though they do occasionally stop asteroid strikes, or so I gather. :)) They have their idea, see, and if you don't agree with it, it's because you're not spiritually advanced/ sensitive/ artistic enough. Where men who are less pretentious are actually willing to learn something.
Women could save themselves a lot of grief by refusing to have sex with any man who thinks this way. And the next generation would be vastly improved, too. As well as smaller. But, what can I say, men aren't the only ones who will believe anything when they're horny; I've been known to believe that a man actually WAS a sensitive new age guy who understood and respected my deepest feelings and ... I mean, I believed this of the most sexist guy you can imagine.
Here's one thing I really cannot stand: the tendency some men have to believe that women are deceptive. Make things up. And so they don't have to believe anything you say, whenever you disagree with them, because you just made it up. Took me years to realise that I just didn't have to talk to such people.
Disengagement, one way or another, with asshats, is the key to a calm life. It's not always possible, of course.
thinking a little more
I mean, I thought all sorts of stupid things about men for years when I was younger, too. I got over it (I think) eventually.
But any man past 30 who spouts this trash has definitely used up his "young ignoramus" pass card. He just isn't TRYING to know any better.
Re: wow, they sprout like mushrooms, don't they
That's the thing -- for every guy on that thread there's a woman willing to fuck him. Those guys will always find somebody. There are even women agreeing with the comments.
But, what can I say, men aren't the only ones who will believe anything when they're horny; I've been known to believe that a man actually WAS a sensitive new age guy who understood and respected my deepest feelings and ...
When I was younger, I kept getting into relationships because it was the "normal" thing. I didn't care for relationships, they annoyed me and made me generally tired, but I was completely saturated with the notion that unless a woman is coupled up she is (or is perceived as) defective. It took a few years to get to the point where I didn't care about how I was perceived.
But where does it come from? Do these guys learn if from their mothers, or what?
(no subject)
(no subject)
I was briefly engaged to an actor boy who didn't seem to be such a bad sort. Then I met him again after he'd been in NYC for several years, getting his ego soundly thrashed in a perpetual go round of professional humiliation, and he'd become the spokesman for Male Superiority.
He found it particulary unbearable that I kept getting work in my field but he couldn't get any in his, so he'd give me long earnest talks about how women are built for child rearing and therefore have no creative instinct. Women get acting jobs because suspension of disbelief won't allow men to play all the parts ... women are published out of pity and political correctness... women only stop making trouble when they have a man to please...
He's recite this stuff to any female he met, but he always managed to find a woman to sleep with him.
(no subject)
Wow, he must have been really hot.
(no subject)
(no subject)
I'm going to be busy catching up this weekend. Except, this weekend is busy with RL stuff. Soon, soon.
(no subject)
Oooh! I was at a party the other night and someone who saw Constantineavoid them.
It does sound like fun. I'd love to take a couple hours off and see that movie.
(no subject)
As for the male attitudes you've encountered, I don't know whether to assure you there are plenty out there who don't think that way or just consider myself insufferably spoiled by two decades of marriage to a guy who also happens to be the head of the Women's Studies department at the school where he teaches. Not to mention worshiping at the feet of his two spoiled daughters, who he thinks are the smartest and best creatures in the universe.
In the meantime, all the males around me are panicking because they only have a "few hours" to finish revising a document that's written and on its umpteenth draft. Heh. They should have worked on my last project, where that amount of time would have been considered a luxury to write and proof the thing. I have finished my pb&j and am off to soothe, approve, and move on.
(no subject)
But I was annoyed by some misconceptions a couple of reviewers on the radio had gotten from the movie and started complaining to her about it yesterday.
They weren't NPR guys, were they? At a party the other night one of the guests, and NPR dj guy, was asking: so, heaven and hell and puragatory overlap? It's a plane-of-consciousness thing?
Catholic partygoers: Yep!
NPR guy: And you guys can catch demons in mirrors, and then smash the mirrror to exorcize them?
Cathlolic partygoers: Uh, there really isn't a manual for catching demons. 1: impossible. 2: Demons = scary. The Catholic position is basically, Demons? Run away!
NPR guy: Do they have heads or not?
Catholic partygoers: We really have to see this movie.
If NPR had silly reviews, it wasn't because we didn't try. :D
I don't know whether to assure you there are plenty out there who don't think that way or just consider myself insufferably spoiled by two decades of marriage to a guy who also happens to be the head of the Women's Studies department at the school where he teaches.
And my buddies' husbands are all pretty sane, so maybe I was just in the wrong dating pool. Maybe performance and comics publishing attracts guys who need the compensatory factor.
(Now I've done it. I'm going to be hearing Ringo Starr saying "It's me compensatory factor" all. Day. Long. :)
(no subject)
It was NPR, but it seems to have been a different guy (an Iowa local) with a completely different misconception, regarding damnation. I don't want to be spoilery, but I gather this was the basic premise of the movie, and the way he explained it had me going, "Huh? No, that completely denies one of the best things about Catholic theology."
But no one was asking for demon killing advice or what their heads looked like. Pity.
(no subject)
Oddly, we stumbled over the head-headless question. We said something like: They're um, pure spirit, no bodies. They don't have heads to... not have. Erp.
I went over to revdorothy's lj and rambled on for the better part of an hour about Constantine (and Angel and Spike and Hell -- subjects dear to my heart). She'll doubtless think I'm mental. :D
I'm glad you mentioned her -- I've been meaning to add her but kept forgetting. I like reading revdorothy's posts, so that's fixed now.
w00t! 60mph gusts! I would fain go out and drive in it. Big Weather, my primary addicition.
ETA: Or not. The wind just blew a chimmney brick loose and it fell into my fireplace with a big ol' crash. Maybe I'll stay home.
(no subject)
And I just stumbled across this guy while researching something for work. I don't have time to finish this post, but the first few paragraphs really struck me:
http://hugoboy.typepad.com/hugo_schwyzer/2005/01/still_sicknbsp_.html
Also, this morning? Freezing again.
Back to work crises.
(no subject)
Dave Sim. Nuff said.
smuggling a query under the public radar
(no subject)
Hey, we're getting 50 mph wind here! Should be arriving in your neck of the woods shortly.
*Hates replying twice/loves midwestern weather.*
(no subject)
I don't know what I'd do if someone said things like that to me. My brain would probably freeze in disbelief.
(no subject)
The majority of my friends have delightful partners/husbands. I can't imagine any of them spouting this stuff. But seriously, there's more of it out there than most women realize.
(no subject)
Blegh. What a complete and utter... dick. I feel the need to apologize on behalf of all the actually rational dudes.
Really, I think women are pretty nifty -- and not for the obvious reasons -- though, I must admit, sometimes I feel like a minority. I can remember having "guy talks" with men like that, and I had to leave. Hopefully by another generation or so, the artificial glow of the 1950's will have faded enough so fewer men will be raised thinking a woman can only be happy with a baby in one hand and a vacum in the other.
(no subject)
I know you are out there, really I do. Comments upthread reminded me time and again that there are perfectly sane men who don't feel compelled to cherish the idea that women are not merely different, but hopelessly inferior.
Maybe I've met so many of the latter because I've worked in areas where many of the guys are just... big kids. Seems kind of obvious now that I think about it.
(no subject)
I was lucky enough – or sheltered enough – not to meet personally many people who think like that , but my own grandmother is one too much. I love her and all – being my only grandparent left and generally very lovely lady, but talking to her is a huge challenge every time.
When I got married, first thing she told me that I now had to get rid of all my female friends, because they are going to be out to get my husband. I still feel the ire.
(no subject)
And there's the second part of it -- there are still so many women out there (to this day) who fall in line with these ideas. The notion that getting a man is the only important thing a woman can ever do isn't just a misogynist opinion; plenty of women act that way too. And then they act astonished and hurt when men treat them like disposable convienience items rather than human beings...
But that's a whole 'nuther rant, and I've got to avoid stress for now in order to get my massive workload under control. :)